“For me, the greatest tragedy is that the church affirmed this and Justin Welby… I can’t remember how he puts it, but Valuing All God’s Children. If we truly want to value all God’s children we certainly don’t affirm these ideologies at such a young age.”
Nigel and Sally Rowe, who were backed by Christian Concern, spoke to GB News’ Calvin Robinson about their huge case victory, which has culminated with a commitment from the government to reform transgender policies in primary schools and £22,000 in legal costs.
The Christian parents shared how they felt devastated and grieved by the Church of England’s stance but were comforted by our support, saying:
“Christian Concern have been incredible and I love them to bits.
“We found that it was nice to spend time with them because they understood biblical truth and so it was very comforting. We didn’t feel alone anymore and, of course, they’ve been supporting us over the last five-six years over this case. It’s been a long time.
“We would encourage anyone in a similar situation to contact them because they stand all the way through, they they are steadfast, they’re supportive, they’ve been amazing support, they’re like family to us now.”
Calvin responded: “They are, I can vouch for them. They’re a fantastic organisation. They do a lot of good work.”
You can learn more about the Rowe’s big victory, how we supported them and how education policy is already changing for the better: https://christianconcern.com/comment/how-parents-challenge-impacted-government-policy/
GB News
3 October 2022
See below for a full automated and, therefore, rough transcript of the interview:
Calvin Robinson: Now, a Christian family has had their appeal settled and a commitment from the government to transform or reform transgender policies in primary schools following a five-year legal battle.
Nigel and his wife Sally Rowe had taken action against the Department of Education after their six-year-old son was labeled transphobic. Six years old, I repeat, by a church of England primary school for refusing to agree with trans-affirming policies.
With me now are the parents in question, Nigel and Sally Rowe, first of all thank you so much for joining me in the studio.
Nigel and Sally Rowe: Thank you very much for having us.
Calvin: How on Earth can a six-year-old be transphobic?
Nigel: Exactly, a six-year-old doesn’t have the cognitive ability to work those sort of things out does it and that’s why this is so utterly ridiculous, but let’s also just remember this was a Church of England school, and for me the the greatest tragedy is that the church affirmed this and Justin Welby’s… I can’t remember how he puts it but Valuing All God’s Children, well, if we truly want to value all God’s children we certainly don’t affirm these ideologies at such a young age.
It’s really tragic but, thankfully, the government, specifically Suella Braverman who is the Attorney General, seems to be in agreement with us, so this is a wonderful turning point.
Calvin: And as Christians yourselves, I assume you sent your son to a Christian School thinking it would be biblically Orthodox and promoting truth as you know it, as you understand it. Was that the case?
Nigel: Absolutely, we are committed Christians and we believe in Biblical truth, we believe for example marriage is between one man one woman, we believe that God created them male and female, in fact Jesus himself said in Matthew 19 “don’t forget I created them male and female” and how it all works together for society and culture, and the family is fundamental to a culture.
The nuclear family, of course this has been being destroyed and broken and we’re beginning to see, I think, the ramifications that in the culture but we as Christians believe that no a boy is a boy and a girl is a girl.
We don’t deny the fact that there will be children that will suffer from gender dysphoria there are those issues and pathological issues that you can have but fundamentally, we as Christians, know that God created them male and female.
Calvin: Right and I want to speak on the kindness and compassion because some people will be watching this thinking that’s very unkind if a child wants to declare that they are transgender then that’s up to them and we should affirm and support them, but surely there are other ways of supporting a child who’s going through gender dysphoria, surely there are other avenues to be compassionate.
Sally: Absolutely, we’ve actually collated lots and lots of evidence that if you affirm that child in a school setting it’s actually very damaging to for the child, let alone all the other children.
It’s very confusing, it’s not the kind thing to do and it can it can send them on a trajectory where they are taking puberty blockers cross-sex hormones, which makes them sterile, and and then into surgery and if all the trusted adults in their lives are affirming them then they begin to believe that and, from the evidence, the loving thing to do, the caring thing to do, is to go outside the school setting, give them the one-to-one help. Often there is a very, very good reasons why they’re confused. It could be so simple as well and if that child gets the due care and attention that they need often these things are ironed out.
Calvin: Well, there are those like myself, Sally, who would say that putting a child on puberty blockers is child abuse because a child cannot change their gender, they can’t consent and they’re not old enough to discern that yet.
However, there will be people that will say actually, no, that’s fair fair enough and they do feel like they are trans, that’s an argument to be made, but in a Church of England school when a six-year-old identifies as a boy and doesn’t necessarily understand that there’s a different ideology and he’s promoting the Christian ideology, God made them male and God made them female and that God made them in his own image, if a child is promoting a Christian value in a Christian School surely that should be acceptable even to the people that have a different perspective?
Nigel: And that’s why I think it causes distress to some children. For example, our children are brought up at home with Christian values. So, therefore, when they go to school they find they’re in a battle, they’re in a battle not only with some teachers but they’re in a battle with other children who are coming out with a different ideology, and it makes it very difficult for children.
Six-year-olds… it’s so young. What does what does a six-year-old know?
A child at six at school should be learning math, science, playing all those things. Do we really want to start pursuing these ideologies of transgenderism?
Calvin: That’s the battle of values that at six years old how do they decide whether it’s the parents values or the teachers values that they take on board. Surely that comes back to why you chose that particular school to send your child to, because you assume they’d have your values.
Nigel: Absolutely, being a church of England school, it fundamentally should have a Biblical Foundation to everything in fact.
Sally: Yeah and I think this was the shocking thing, when we received the letter from the school it was “you are transphobic”, and really we just thought you’re not… there’s no support we even contacted the local diocese and they showed no support either.
I think we were shocked when we did speak out about it because we thought this needs to be clarified in law and we need to be protecting young children.
The church on the whole was silent, and some were even openly against us, and I think that’s what we found so shocking and devastating. It grieved us.
Calvin: I’m sure that the local diocese would disagree with that but if if you’re not getting support from the diocese where can other Christians go? If you’re speaking to other parents right now and they’re not getting support from their local priest or their Bishop where can they go?
Nigel: Well that that is one of the problems, where can they go you? Ultimately the church should be the bastion of of a moral foundation in a society.
But, even in the secular world, I think they often have greater respect for people in the church who say: “no, actually we stand on these values, these are the Biblical values we stand on. You may not agree with it but these are the the values that we stand with as Christians and in Christian Schools.
Calvin: But, it wasn’t rhetorical, Nigel, I mean generally where did you go for support, who who did help you? What organisation’s can people reach out to? There will be many people across the country who are in a very similar situation.
Nigel: It’s a very lonely place, it is a very lonely place, and actually many people we had fellowship with for years didn’t support us… This was such a shock however there are pockets of Christians all around the UK, and all around the world, and, specifically, Christian Concern who supported us, they’ve been incredible and I love them to bits.
We found that it was nice to spend time with them because they understood biblical truth and so it was very comforting. We didn’t feel alone anymore and, of course, they’ve been supporting us over the last five-six years over this case. It’s been a long time.
Sally: We would encourage anyone in a similar situation to contact them because they stand all the way through, they they are steadfast, they’re supportive, they’ve been amazing support, they’re like family to us now aren’t they.
Nigel: They are.
Calvin: They are, I can vouch for them. They’re a fantastic organisation. They do a lot of good work.
What’s the current situation with your son’s school?
Nigel: We homeschool. We don’t know what they’re showing in school, so we we actually now homeschool. I think we we’ve upset the education establishment, probably the Church of England as well… We’re not not particularly popular, but that’s to be expected, you know Jesus said “remember when they hate you, they hated me first.”
Calvin: “Yes, that’s the quote I was trying to say earlier. Thank you.
Nigel: You we’re. [laughs]
Sally: Actually, to encourage parents, homeschooling has been absolutely amazing for our boys, we’re part of a good community as well and they have thrived and it’s been very fruitful for them, they’re blossoming and growing so it’s been amazing.
Calvin: “We’ve got time for one short answer. Homeschooling is something I very much promote because you cannot rely on the schools not to have a political ideology these days. Where can parents go to if they want to start homeschooling their own children.
Sally: There’s CHESS, that’s a good organisation, there’s classical conversations they’re also a very good organisation, there’s a couple there.
Calvin: Thank you so much. God bless you both.
Find out more about The Rowes
